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Poster: light into ashes Date: Aug 2, 2011 12:41pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Why Don't You Like the 80's?

Traditionally there is a lot of negativity & criticism on the forum...the longer you stay, the more you'll see that certain people are especially negative, others more positive about the full range of the Dead's career, and you'll work out who's who...

I was also surprised so many people jumped on the '80s, I'd thought they were more popular around here!
Given that, though, it's interesting that so many of us singled out the early '80s up to '83 or so as still being pretty good...

Your position is, I think, probably the most traditional one among deadheads - many people in the past have posted similar thoughts as yours.
That said, I have to strongly disagree with the idea that "these tapes, they're just memories." Many of us were never in "the scene," and some of us are not so thrilled that the band "always showed up for the party, good days or bad." (That was, after all, how years like '86, '92, and '95 happened.)
The tapes are what we have now. People who were in the scene tend to be kinder to them (not always) - but the music can be listened to on its own, and listeners don't have to be so forgiving now... I'll be the first to say that, by your lights, I missed the trip!

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Poster: Excess Date: Aug 2, 2011 1:33pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Why Don't You Like the 80's?

To the Brent haters, all I have to say is: Watch this: http://vimeo.com/11803382 Blow Away video from 7/7/89. There's no denying Brent's power no matter how you feel about his fit with the band. Besides, how can you not like a guy who can make Jerry smile and dance like that?

Here's an interesting stat: I'm part of a FB group of Deadheads that are being used as a sounding board for the development of a online Dead game. In their poll of 500 Heads, the average age was 42 and the average age of first show was 16. That puts 1985 as the introductory year for the average Head. I don't know if 500 is enough of a sample to really paint a picture of "the average Head" but it's a decent sample.

Maybe it means that half the forum posters are full of it when it comes to "being there"..........or maybe it means that older heads just aren't into FB. But it kinda makes you wonder................

Personally, I don't think you can compare the eras of the Dead, they were constantly evolving. Pigpen's Dead was not Keith's Dead, which was not Brent's Dead. I never listened much to post Brent Dead but once I started digging through the Archive, I found a whole mine full of nuggets.

I say each era was a band unto themselves and should be celebrated for their differences not picked apart.

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Poster: jerlouvis Date: Aug 2, 2011 3:20pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Why Don't You Like the 80's?

"I say each era is a band unto themselves and should be celebrated for their differences not picked apart"

Welcome to the mix,and not to be adversarial here,but why can't we feel however we want about the subject,I surely don't appreciate being told I can't be critical of something because it doesn't sit well with you.

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Poster: boat man Date: Aug 3, 2011 5:17am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Why Don't You Like the 80's?

Take it easy; I understand.
I won't be critical of people being critical. I'm not a seasoned poster, just a seasoned reader of posters.

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Poster: jerlouvis Date: Aug 3, 2011 10:57am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Why Don't You Like the 80's?

I did not want to make you feel unwelcome,and it had nothing to do with being critical or not being critical,when you state that someone is wrong because they don't see things the same as you,that is insulting and ignorant.I would like to welcome you and hope you become a frequent poster and look forward to conversing with you down the road.

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Poster: boat man Date: Aug 3, 2011 11:48am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Why Don't You Like the 80's?

No worries, and thanks for the thought.
I realize that sentiment, sarcasm, and directness are easily misinterpreted in short unfamiliar text. I, myself tend to write a little sarcastically, but with good intentions.
I promise you, though, I never meant to imply that you or anyone was wrong. I just shot out a thought to people who don't know me. I seldom post on forums; I'm more of a "lurker" I guess.
I read this one for the great info that often comes up. Despite my take on live shows, I've collected tapes for thirty five years.
Sorry if I came off pretentious.

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Poster: Excess Date: Aug 3, 2011 1:19am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Why Don't You Like the 80's?

Hey man, if criticism's your kick, I wish it for you. I'm just saying that comparing '72 Dead to '82 Dead is like apples to oranges.

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Poster: jerlouvis Date: Aug 3, 2011 10:33am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Why Don't You Like the 80's?

Firstly,criticism is not "my thing",you might not want to make assumptions about people you don't know.If being critical about something has a valid place in a discussion,I will be brutally frank,that is what intelligent adults do,hippie douche bags on the other hand find it negative and counter productive to the whole GD ideal,but after all they are hippie douche bags,judging by your opening post here on the forum,telling a bunch of people you don't know how they should conduct themselves,I will go out on limb and say your handle of excess is not a reference to your level of intelligence in comparison to say,a moron,I think you are on equal footing with your average moron.You might be better suited to your goofy Facebook,GD game creating friends,because you are out of your depth here.This will hopefully close any (definitely on my part) interaction between us for the duration of your participation on this forum.

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Poster: Excess Date: Aug 3, 2011 3:47pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Why Don't You Like the 80's?

.......and that's why I usually avoid forums. They're heavily peppered with misanthropic creatures like yourself who can only feel self worth through the disparagement of others under the guise of "being brutally frank".

I truly pity you. Embrace your contempt as you grow old, one day it will be all you have left.

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Poster: AltheaRose Date: Aug 2, 2011 7:58pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Why Don't You Like the 80's?

That's interesting about the game poll. How'd they get the sample? Are they really sampling "Deadheads" or "Deadheads on Facebook who friend or 'like' certain pages?" I do assume they wouldn't be targeting Deadheads per se as much as Deadheads Likely to Play an Online Game. Which will be a younger demographic by definition.

Certainly crowds grew exponentially in later years, and while not all the tie-dyed sardines in those stadiums would self-identify as Deadheads (particularly many years later), I assume it would still skew the demographics somewhat so that a non-Facebook sample might produce a similar result. (E.g. average age 42.) Would be curious to see any stats.



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Poster: boat man Date: Aug 2, 2011 1:01pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Why Don't You Like the 80's?

You make a good point. Fair enough, and well said.
By "memories", I suppose I just really meant days gone by, not so much my own.
I grew up at the shows, and later,as an adult, used them for seeing people and places I might not otherwise have seen. I have no clue how many. My own memories are of the venues, the views, and the pure joy of it all.
On sub par nights, I don't recall being let down just glad that they gave me a reason to be there; chasing that ever elusive goodie.
So, I'm not so hard on the eighties, though the seventies were better. They just got older and slowed down, or what have you, as we all do. You could still hear them trying to please you, from time to time.
Anyway, thanks for your comments. And I don't think that you missed the trip at all. You seem to have gotten it just fine.

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Poster: bkidwell Date: Aug 2, 2011 2:23pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Why Don't You Like the 80's?

I will tell you something you should know, in case you don't know it, since you say you are new to the forum, and I don't know how much internet Grateful Dead reading you do. Have you ever been to:

http://deadessays.blogspot.com/

Which is Light into Ashes blog, which collects a lot of his writing and research about the Grateful Dead? If you haven't been there prepared to be completely amazed and find dozens of hours of enjoyable reading and study!

LIA is, in my opinion (and probably the opinion of many others) the best writer and researcher about the music of the Grateful Dead. That is meant to take nothing away from all the other people who have made great contributions, and certainly the work of the Deadbase authors back in the day could be said to be more historically important - but in terms of writing about the band focusing on the music, and how the history of the band relates to the music, LIA has done amazing things which engage more deeply with the actual content of the music and shows than anything else I have ever read.

So, when you say he "seems to have gotten it just fine" it makes me chuckle, because in my opinion, all of us are really incredibly lucky to have someone like him writing on this forum. I may enjoy the band's later work more than he does, but I think his criticisms are well-founded and perceptive, and help me understand the music. It's an honor to discuss the issues involved with him.

Maybe you knew all that, so sorry if I was explaining the obvious to you. There are also many other great posters here on this forum who impress me with their listening observations and knowledge, or contribute in other great ways. William Tell, dead-head Monte, Althea Rose, often Cliff Hucker (when he isn't busy arguing about god-knows-what), Jerlouvis, Strat, Micah, heck, tons more - all have an amazing amount of life or listening experience with the band or both, and are generous in sharing knowledge.

Man, I love this place. Sorry to anyone I didn't shout-out in that post, I realized since I was busy talking about how awesome LIA was I shouldn't ignore all the other great posters here, if you're not on the list, I'm sorry and I'll buy a healthy fruit juice if I ever meet you as an apology. Also, since I have now descended into merely stream-of-consciousness typing, I am really excited about tomorrow's day in history. We have 8/3/69 coming up and I hope we can all talk about that show, because that show is just something else!

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Poster: boat man Date: Aug 3, 2011 4:50am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Why Don't You Like the 80's?

Yes, I've read them in depth, but no, I had no idea I was corrosponding with the author. I'm humbled, thank you.

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